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Jayc13 Posts: 55
3/6/2020
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I can't this soft cover Fireside book.
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collectibleshop Posts: 3088
3/6/2020
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books like that aren't listed because they aren't comic books with stories. Otherwise there'd be thousands more of those coloring/puzzle books to list.
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Ronbatman Administrator Posts: 2530
3/6/2020
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Collectible Shop is correct.
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Defiant1 Posts: 720
3/8/2020
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Some books like this do have comic art in them. You can't always make assumptions.
This book has some very early New X-Men comic book art introducing an X-Men puzzle. It came out shortly after X-Men #94.
This is a coloring book, but it's filled with story art.
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collectibleshop Posts: 3088
3/8/2020
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Defiant1 wrote:
Some books like this do have comic art in them. You can't always make assumptions.
This book has some very early New X-Men comic book art introducing an X-Men puzzle. It came out shortly after X-Men #94.
This is a coloring book, but it's filled with story art.
No one said anything about whether these types books have comic ART, as they all do. That's not the criteria in question, otherwise there'd be thousands more listed. They have no STORIES is the problem (one or 2 pages of an actual previously released comic book story to color is not enough story to qualify), hence they're not comic books CPG would or should list. While CPG does list a couple from a while ago, the Marvel one, according to the cover blurb, may have a simple story to go with the maze puzzle, so that may be why it's listed. It may also be that after that was listed CPG changed their minds about coloring books. I don't see the Bucky O'Hare one in the CPG guide.
edited by collectibleshop on 3/8/2020
edited by collectibleshop on 3/8/2020
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BasementComics Posts: 784
3/8/2020
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Would a "Choose your own adventure" style book count?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/SUPER-POWERS-Justice-League-of-America-Which-Way-Books-3-CYOA-vtg-DC-Comics/233303810822?hash=item3651fda306:g:jYsAAOSwfSJdRHV-
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collectibleshop Posts: 3088
3/8/2020
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BasementComics wrote:
Would a "Choose your own adventure" style book count?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/SUPER-POWERS-Justice-League-of-America-Which-Way-Books-3-CYOA-vtg-DC-Comics/233303810822?hash=item3651fda306:g:jYsAAOSwfSJdRHV-
after looking at it, I first thought, 'maybe', then decided probably not, as it's more of a text story BOOK book with scattered illustrations, like many such books that aren't counted as comic books, but that's up to the powers that be at CPG, and that ain't me. I tried multiple searches on here, including publishers, and didn't find it, so I usually assume if something that old of a major 'name' isn't listed by now, there's a reason. Pocket Books that are here are usually actual graphic novels or reprints of comic strips, so those are listed, but I wouldn't fully call this book a comic book myself.
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BasementComics Posts: 784
3/8/2020
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collectibleshop wrote:
BasementComics wrote:
Would a "Choose your own adventure" style book count?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/SUPER-POWERS-Justice-League-of-America-Which-Way-Books-3-CYOA-vtg-DC-Comics/233303810822?hash=item3651fda306:g:jYsAAOSwfSJdRHV-
after looking at it, I first thought, 'maybe', then decided probably not, as it's more of a text story BOOK book with scattered illustrations, like many such books that aren't counted as comic books, but that's up to the powers that be at CPG, and that ain't me. I tried multiple searches on here, including publishers, and didn't find it, so I usually assume if something that old of a major 'name' isn't listed by now, there's a reason. Pocket Books that are here are usually actual graphic novels or reprints of comic strips, so those are listed, but I wouldn't fully call this book a comic book myself.
I totally agree with you but figured I'd ask.
Thanks!
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Defiant1 Posts: 720
3/9/2020
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collectibleshop wrote:
Defiant1 wrote:
Some books like this do have comic art in them. You can't always make assumptions.
This book has some very early New X-Men comic book art introducing an X-Men puzzle. It came out shortly after X-Men #94.
This is a coloring book, but it's filled with story art.
No one said anything about whether these types books have comic ART, as they all do. That's not the criteria in question, otherwise there'd be thousands more listed. They have no STORIES is the problem (one or 2 pages of an actual previously released comic book story to color is not enough story to qualify), hence they're not comic books CPG would or should list. While CPG does list a couple from a while ago, the Marvel one, according to the cover blurb, may have a simple story to go with the maze puzzle, so that may be why it's listed. It may also be that after that was listed CPG changed their minds about coloring books. I don't see the Bucky O'Hare one in the CPG guide.
edited by collectibleshop on 3/8/2020
edited by collectibleshop on 3/8/2020
What is your definition of a story? Are collections of Bloom County cartoons a story? It's technically a lot of stories. The Marvel Mazes book has single page "stories" introducing some puzzle. They aren't generic "comic art". They are story pages unique to this specific book. They have panels and dialogue with word balloons. I think it's highly significant given the time frame of when it was published. I don't care what the guide lists. I just think it's ridiculous to exclude things that are comic related when collectors tend to care about the stuff. The Bucky O'Hare Coloring Book is a full blown story that you can color. The Bucky O'Hare Coloring book was sold through Neal Adams' site. It was probably never solicited through Previews.
My point was that you can't make assumptions.
People might assume this coloring book isn't a comic, but it is:
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Ronbatman Administrator Posts: 2530
3/10/2020
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This is the criteria that we use.
The book has to be at least 50% comic book. Which means it tells a comic book story.
Not a comic strip.
So if a coloring book is an uncolored comic book, then it would be eligible to be added to CPG.
Defiant1, I don't think our stance is "ridiculous to exclude things". I understand why you want it in the database but the exponential growth of adding comic-related items is off the charts. There are millions and millions of comic-related items, toys, books, stuffed animals, cards, statues, action figures, posters, movies, records, puzzle books, Hot Wheels, original art, Funko pops, etc. 1 million comics is more than enough for us. There is an opportunity for someone with time and money to create what you want but I'm not sure that it would be financially prudent.
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collectibleshop Posts: 3088
3/10/2020
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Defiant1 wrote:
What is your definition of a story? Are collections of Bloom County cartoons a story? It's technically a lot of stories. The Marvel Mazes book has single page "stories" introducing some puzzle. They aren't generic "comic art". They are story pages unique to this specific book. They have panels and dialogue with word balloons. I think it's highly significant given the time frame of when it was published. I don't care what the guide lists. I just think it's ridiculous to exclude things that are comic related when collectors tend to care about the stuff. The Bucky O'Hare Coloring Book is a full blown story that you can color.
The Bucky O'Hare Coloring book was sold through Neal Adams' site. It was probably never solicited through Previews.
My point was that you can't make assumptions.
Your original 'point', "Some books like this do have comic art in them. You can't always make assumptions", was based on the ART, not all the content, and of course those type of books have comic art, so that point was moot.
I made an 'assumption' based on the INTERIOR pics on the auction of the Super Powers book, as I don't own the book to look thru the entire thing, and I felt there were enough pics to base my OPINION on, that it would not qualify as a comic book. I stand by that, as does CPG's standards. The Marvel Mazes book IS listed in CPG as it qualifies, and I said so. Bloom County TPBs and many other comic strip ones are listed too, and I don't really agree with that but don't care that much, but they do have continuing (short) stories as well as a continuing 'long' storyline. Other than actual comic book characters like Spider-Man, The Phantom, Peanuts etc., most comic strips are not based on comic book characters or have comic books made about them, yet they're listed here.
Seems to me the Bucky O'Hare book should be too, since as you say, it has a full comic story you can color. Easy for CPG to miss something that was only sold thru Adams' site. Perhaps the Superman one would too, if you provided more pics to show it has 'comics' with stories and not just 1 panel splash pages, but the cover blurb suggests it has stories, so maybe CPG will add it if given more info. Will leave that up to Ron.
The tiny amount of people who collect coloring books isn't worth the time it would take to add all of them that DON'T have stories, nor is the 'value' of them. CPG can't list everything, and their criteria that it has to be 50% comic book that tells a story seems reasonable to me. MOST coloring/puzzle/game books wouldn't qualify.
I'm out now.
edited by collectibleshop on 3/10/2020
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Jayc13 Posts: 55
3/18/2020
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now that I'm catching up, I completely disagree! other databases have all comic periodicals, calling it as EXCLUSIVE COMIC ART related is wrong.
and technically, it wasn't a coloring book. I would think all the Fireside books would be here.
explains why some of the magazines I've looked for, are never found on here. having magazines like Comic Book Artist is here, but not having Comicology books baffles me when other websites includes it all.
edited by JayC13 on 3/18/2020
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collectibleshop Posts: 3088
3/18/2020
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Jayc13 wrote:
now that I'm catching up, I completely disagree! other databases have all comic periodicals, calling it as EXCLUSIVE COMIC ART related is wrong.
and technically, it wasn't a coloring book. I would think all the Fireside books would be here.
explains why some of the magazines I've looked for, are never found on here. having magazines like Comic Book Artist is here, but not having Comicology books baffles me when other websites includes it all.
edited by JayC13 on 3/18/2020
Annnd I'm back in for a sec on this. This site is a PRICE GUIDE for real comic books, not just a database like most of the sites I think you're referring to, and they've stated the guidelines for what they consider a COMIC BOOK. No one said the Fireside book was a coloring book. Nor is it a periodical, since those things don't come out on any schedule. But it's NOT a comic book with stories, so doesn't qualify to be listed here. The Fireside books that have actual comic stories or are reprints of them are here. I noted the Bucky O'Hare one could/should be listed if it has an actual story as Defiant says, and the Marvel Mazes one apparently does, so they qualify. A book with just games, puzzles etc doesn't, regardless of the art.
That's life in the price guide world, you can't please everyone. I doubt Overstreet lists that Fireside book either.
edited by collectibleshop on 3/18/2020
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Defiant1 Posts: 720
3/21/2020
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Jayc13 wrote:
now that I'm catching up, I completely disagree! other databases have all comic periodicals, calling it as EXCLUSIVE COMIC ART related is wrong.
and technically, it wasn't a coloring book. I would think all the Fireside books would be here.
explains why some of the magazines I've looked for, are never found on here. having magazines like Comic Book Artist is here, but not having Comicology books baffles me when other websites includes it all.
edited by JayC13 on 3/18/2020
My point of view also. A Fireside Book of Marvel Content is of more interest to collectors than a dead indy company that published one comic in B&W in the 80's with grade school art. It's not my site, so I don't care. I respect the right of the owners to list whatever they want.
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Defiant1 Posts: 720
3/21/2020
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I recall an editor at Overstreet mentioning that the Overstreet Price Guide listed the Atlas/Seaboard "My Secrets" magazine in their guide. I said, "you do realize that it's not a comic" He never responded back. There is absolutely nothing comic related about it except a model wearing a Captain America shirt on the cover. I thought it ironic that a guide which limits what they list to a fraction of what's published had no problem listing a non-comic magazine.
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